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Mike on Art Bell’s Dark Matter Tonight
It’s too bad I don’t have XM radio. I’ll have to catch it in the YouTube archive after it’s posted. Good luck, or do they say “break a leg” in radio?
thanks!
Hello Mike. I listened to the show with Art Bell today on my MP3 player. I really liked it, and you answered rather well overall. As for the questions of proofing biological entities with biology vs proofing God with philosophical reasoning, I just wanted to point out that if I would have been you, I would have mentioned the science of NDEs and OBEs as evidence of not only the afterlife but also for a Supreme Being. At least, serious research in NDEs/OBEs (like Jeffrey Long’s book, “Evidence of the Afterlife: The Science of Near-Death Experiences” and peer-reviewed journal articles) demonstrates that there is a spiritual world using the scientific method.
Also, there is some good considerable evidence that spirits exists. Dr. Gary Schwartz from the University of Arizona has scientific publications and books on this matter. He carefully lays on the table the plausibility of the existence of deceased spirits, and angels. See some articles here: http://www.drgaryschwartz.com/SAMPLE-PUBLICATIONS.html
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“Research documenting how it is possible to detect the presence of spirit using a silicon photomultiplier system, described in Chapter 14 of THE SACRED PROMISE,was published in 2010 in the peer-reviewed journal EXPLORE: The Journal of Science & Healing. You can read a pdf copy of the paper by clicking this button”
“Research documenting how it is possible to detect the presence of spirit using a Low Light CCD camera system, described in Chapter 13 of THE SACRED PROMISE,was published in 2011 in the peer-reviewed journal EXPLORE: The Journal of Science & Healing. You can read a pdf copy of the paper by clicking this button”
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Also, there is some evidence for a Supreme Being and hostile, evil spirits in the field of demonology and exorcism. This is a bit less objective than NDEs/OBEs as it is done by the specialized researchers like Jeffrey Long (Physician), and more subjective, yes, but still considerable after good sifting of the reports, interviews, cases, etc. A bit like ufology and alien abductions.
All of the above does not specifically prove the God of the Bible, per se (not problem for you and me there), but, at least, it definitely points to an alternate reality, a spiritual realm, spirits (good and bad), and more plausibly a Supreme Being, without being able to scientifically identify that Supreme Being of light.
I argued for some of this stuff in one of my papers at Concordia University under Prof. Lorenzo DiTommaso.
understood; I sort of wrapped all that into “my money’s on Dean Radin instead of Matthew Alper.”
It’s on Youtube Carl (or anyone else) and you may download the whole thing with http://www.listentoyoutube.com and then put it on a portable device. I was also going to subscribe to XM, but * the trouble.
Finally got through it. Great show! You baffled Art and listeners alike with your “unpigeonholeableness”, a man after my own heart. And you articulated your position clearly for each of them, though Art remained a little cynical of your objectivity.
As it waxed increasingly biblical there was one thing that was kind of danced around, or perhaps implied, that was never directly addressed. I agree with your standards of biological/physical vs. nonbiological/non-physical. But, while proving, or philosophizing, the existence of God–which God do we go for?
The Greek gods make great sense in relation to human psychology, the Biblical God makes great sense in terms of an omnipotent creator or Intelligent Designer. What about the god of the Koran, or the Hindu deities and so on? The comparison was never made. The “Bible box” was never stepped out of.
One mystery that seemed particularly juicy that I hadn’t thought as deeply about was Adam and Eve. Who or what is that story really talking about? I loved the thorny question you asked: “why can’t they be millions of years of old?”
The fossil record is chronological. We don’t have certain plants or critters before certain other plants and critters, and vice versa. So then, who were this Adam and Eve and what is the story telling us? Hmmmmm.
nice word coinage! The fossil record is mostly chronological (there are anomalies, but no one really wants to do science by anomaly).
the differentiation in gods you note is one of character and attributes (they aren’t the same thing, though they get conflated). And of course definitions in either of those categories have some variance. The weakest link in here is the Hindu one. Polytheistic systems like that are really describing anything non-human, or deities that are impersonal (or both) and don’t really adapt well to logic. (Eastern thinkers will point that out as a virtue, to which I usually reply, “would you like me to answer your question with western logic or no logic at all?).
Those who read my Naked Bible blog will know that I don’t regard Genesis (or the Bible) as intended to teach science. My reason for that isn’t to concede anything to science (though I don’t feel much pain there). Rather, I take the position so I can compare apples with apples, and not impose a worldview on the biblical writers they didn’t have, and then turn around and judge them for it. The Bible never claims to provide science because the worldview of the writers didn’t revolve around the scientific method and the kinds of knowledge it produces. On the flip side, I also don’t believe that the truth propositions the Bible *does* put forth contradict real science, either. But that’s a deep rabbit hole.
I really enjoyed your interview. You were very patient with the uneducated folks and the true believer types. Your segment on Sitchin was great. Of course there are lots of people who won’t believe you no matter what length you go to show them what the facts are.
The Matthew Alpert interview was really annoying. I think it annoyed Art Bell too. I guess atheism can be a religion, too.
Dave Lewis
I’ll have to listen to that one in replay. I’ve listened to Art interview him before in the “old days” and wasn’t quite sure what Art was buying or not. Art’s good for that, which I think is one of his strengths as a host.
yeah, I know you don’t regard the Bible as science, nor that the two don’t necessarily conflict. I was hoping you’d go down that rabbit hole ;-P Especially re: Adam and Eve. If you don’t have time or feel it’s out of place on this blog, I understand.
Readers can check out my posts related (in some way) to that over at Naked Bible:
http://michaelsheiser.com/TheNakedBible/category/genesis/adam/