A reader recently asked me about these references. I’m asked this question often enough I thought I’d blog on it. Let me say from the outset that, though I will disagree (with a high degree of security in my mind) with common interpretations, particularly those of Tom Horn and Dave Flynn, I do not regard their identification of the stones of fire with planets wacky. It’s just not right. I’ll try to explain why.
Here is the passage in Ezekiel (28:14-16; ESV):
14 You were an anointed guardian cherub.
I placed you; you were on the holy mountain of God;
in the midst of the stones of fire you walked.
15 You were blameless in your ways
from the day you were created,
till unrighteousness was found in you.
16 In the abundance of your trade
you were filled with violence in your midst, and you sinned;
so I cast you as a profane thing from the mountain of God,
and I destroyed you, O guardian cherub,
from the midst of the stones of fire.
The passage is part of the diatribe of Ezekiel against the prince of Tyre, in which Ezekiel utilizes the story of a divine being in the garden of Eden who was expelled from the garden. Many scholars think the language speaks of Adam. I believe it refers to the Shining One (the nachash – in my view incorrectly understood as a snake) in Genesis 3.1
The context makes it quite clear that we aren’t talking about planets. How? Because the “stones of fire” are on the holy mountain of God, a reference to the Garden of Eden. Eden? Yes – if you look at Ezek 28:13 (one verse before the citation above) you’ll see that the anointed cherub is also said to be in Eden (the verse should pup up for you here in this blog). Anyone familiar with divine council imagery knows that there are two places where Yahweh and his council (like all deities with councils in ancient literature) meet for business and, in fact, “live”–mountains and well-watered gardens. Eden is where Yahweh lived, and that is why Eden is described as both in the Old Testament. I have a whole chapter on this in my book, but suffice it to say here that imagery from Eden is carried on through to other holy (cosmic) mountains ON EARTH – Sinai and Zion. Recall that Sinai was a mountain (a large “stone”) whose top was afire, and where God met people in/with fire (think of the burning bush here, among other scenes on Sinai; Exod 3, Deut 33; Ezekiel 1, 2 Sam 22:4ff., etc.). God often meets people with fire or in association with fire. Additionally, the divine beings associated with Yahweh’s throne room are referred to as “flames of fire” (Psa. 104:4; see also Ezekiel 1’s references to fire). It’s all very familiar within Old Testament scholarship and the study of Israelite religion. Whoever this is, they are in Eden / the mountain of God – i.e., the place where Yahweh lived at the beginning after he created humans on earth. Nothing unusual.
There is a lot of supporting material for this view. Other than works on the cosmic mountain imagery in the Old Testament and the ancient Near East,2 we can look at the visions of Enoch in the book of 1 Enoch. During his flight through the sky over earth (not on another planet), Enoch sees certain geographical places that are described very similarly to the language in Ezekiel. Note the wordings in the passage below that also appear in Ezekiel 28: fire, precious stones, flame.
1 Enoch 18:6-11
6 I came and saw a place that was burning night and day, where (there were) seven mountains of precious stones-three lying to the east and three to the south. 7/ And of those to the east, <one was> of colored stone, and one was of pearl, and one was of <jasper>. And those to the south were of flame-colored stone. 8/ And the middle one of them reached to heaven like the throne of God-of antimony; and the top of the throne was of lapis lazuli. 9/ And I saw a burning fire. 10 And beyond these mountains is a place, the edge of the great earth; there the heavens come to an end. 11/ And I saw a great chasm among pillars of heavenly fire. And I saw in it pillars of fire descending; and they were immeasurable toward the depth and toward the height.
19:1 And Uriel said to me, “There stand the angels who mingled with the women. And their spirits-having assumed many forms-bring destruction on men and lead them astray to sacrifice to demons as to gods until the day of the great judgment, in which they will be judged with finality. 2/ And the wives of the transgressing angels will become sirens.”3
It’s quite obvious Ezekiel is viewing the earth – he gets as far as the place where the firmament of heaven meets the earth (recall that, in ancient thought — including the Bible — the earth was thought to be round and flat, with a solid dome over its top, the edges of which met the earth’s edge or was “held up” by the mountains).4.
Enoch’s description is actually a striking description of the “world tree” mythology – that the dome over the top of the earth was held up by a huge tall tree (or mountain), which went through the center of the earth, and down into the abyss (note the abyss [“chasm” language in the above citation). The stones of fire = the cosmic mountain, the place where heaven and earth meet, where the gods (or in this case, the God of Israel) lives and renders judgment. At the bottom of that mountain, in its deep recesses, the sons of God who committed the sin of Genesis 6 are kept imprisoned (read on to 1 Enoch 19:1ff.). This has nothing to do with outer space.
There is a pile of material written on this passage and its associated topics. The best books is: Kelley Coblentz Bautch, A Study of the Geography of 1 Enoch 17-19: ‘No One Has Seen What I Have Seen’ (Leiden: E. J. Brill, 2003). It is very expensive and very technical. Likewise for the discussion of the passages cited above in the best 1 Enoch commentary in print, George Nickelsburg’s (cited below in footnote 3).
Luckily, Google Books allows a preview of some pages in Bautch’s book. I was able to piece together screen shots of 12 pages corresponding to the above discussion. Since these pages are available to public viewing on the web, I felt I could PDF them for you all and link to them HERE.
- For more on my views on Genesis 3, readers can subscribe to my newsletter archive (available at www.michaelsheiser.com) to get the draft of my book-in-process on the divine council worldview. ↩
- The classic treatment is Richard J. Clifford, The Cosmic Mountain in Canaan and the Old Testament (Harvard Semitic Monographs 4; Cambridge: Harvard University Press, 1972. ↩
- Nickelsburg, G. W. E., & Baltzer, K. (2001). 1 Enoch : A commentary on the book of 1 Enoch. Includes the text of the Ethiopic book of Enoch in English translation. (276). Minneapolis, Minn.: Fortress. ↩
- For the round, flat earth cosmology, see the PowerPoint File here. That the firmament was considered to be SOLID in the Old Testament is obvious from passages like Job 37:18 – “firm as a mirror of cast metal”) ↩
I do not see how stones of fire could represent planets in the first place. I admit that my bible knowledge is a work in progress, but I am not aware of the information available to corroborate such a claim. I do know that there was the idea in the ancient world that the stars were some sort of heavenly beings or even the sun being like a heavenly being moving across the sky, but I am at a loss to find any reference to planetary bodies as stones of fire. This argument from Dr. Heiser makes more sense to me.
WoW…thank you for that amazing commentary and the associated links (good to know that others have asked!) Based then upon your reply it seems the answer could realistically be gleaned from a poetic device used by the scribe “….you were [up]on the holy mountain of God; in the midst of the stones of fire you walked,” with “stones of fire” functioning as a/the mountain’s construct? Just a thought.
@neoargon: yes; stars and planetary bodies were considered in the ancient world to be deities. Why? Because many of them MOVED – and so it was thought they were alive / animate. The Bible shares this view in passages like Job 38:7-8.
@Debra: it’s another way of referring to the abode of the divine council. If you are not familiar with the divine council, go to my other site, http://www.thedivinecouncil.com for an intro.
MSH: Any good material I can get my hands on from Amazon or Logos for this? Which other scholars have published book-like materials that link Isaiah 14 and Ezekiel 28 together (and even possibly Genesis 3) as you do from Internal and External sources?
@blop2008: There isn’t much. Most scholars assume there is no connection to Genesis 3 b/c there is no serpent in Isa 14 or Ezek 28 — whereas I think that is a reverse approach to what ought to be asked (“where is the divine being in Gen 3?”). Most also think Isa 14 and Ezek 28 refer to a man (Adam) since the material being drawn on is aimed at a man (the king of Tyre, king of Babylon). I think you can see how such assumptions result in an a priori ruling out of a Genesis 3 connection. There is a scholarly monograph (van Djik) that argues at points for serpentine connections between Ezekiel 28 and Gen 13, and you’ll see hints now and again in certain articles. Not much in terms of a wider correlation. It comes in pieces in the scholarly literature when it comes.
MSH: Right, I see. For example the translators notes in the NET (New English translation) Bible in Ezekiel 28:13 mention: “The imagery of the lament appears to draw upon an extrabiblical Eden tradition about the expulsion of the first man (see v. 14 and the note there) from the garden due to his pride. The biblical Eden tradition speaks of cherubs placed as guardians at the garden entrance following the sin of Adam and Eve (Gen 3:24), but no guardian cherub like the one described in verse 14 is depicted or mentioned in the biblical account…” and for verse 14: ” Heb “you (were) an anointed cherub that covers and I placed you.” In the Hebrew text the ruler of Tyre is equated with a cherub, and the verb “I placed you” is taken with what follows (“on the holy mountain of God”). However, this reading is problematic. The pronoun “you” at the beginning of verse 14 is feminine singular in the Hebrew text; elsewhere in this passage the ruler of Tyre is addressed with masculine singular forms. It is possible that the pronoun is a rare (see Deut 5:24; Num 11:15) or defectively written (see 1 Sam 24:19; Neh 9:6; Job 1:10; Ps 6:3; Eccl 7:22) masculine form, but it is more likely that the form should be repointed as the preposition “with” (see the LXX). In this case the ruler of Tyre is compared to the first man, not to a cherub. If this emendation is accepted, then the verb “I placed you” belongs with what precedes and concludes the first sentence in the verse. It is noteworthy that the verbs in the second and third lines of the verse also appear at the end of the sentence in the Hebrew text. The presence of a conjunction at the beginning of “I placed you” is problematic for the proposal, but it may reflect a later misunderstanding of the syntax of the verse. ”
It’s a good point you make when you say that we should look back at Genesis 3 and see if a Cosmic being can be found there. Then, one could go onto subtlelities such as the serpentine look of the Nachash and so on.
@blop2008: One correction (or, better, addition) to make on the NET Bible note. It is true that the pronoun “you” that begins v. 14 is feminine. And the NET editor does a good job of noting that this morphological form can still be a rare masculine. It is also the case that instead of this pronoun we may repoint to the preposition “with” (same consonants in Hebrew). What the editor fails to mention is that we may also have the nota accusativa here (the accusative marker). In that case, we would have what’s known as a casus pendens construction here, in terms of syntax, which would mean the correct translation would be, “As for the anointed cherub [or, As for you, anointed cherub], I established you [masculine]; you were on the holy mountain of God…” This removes any “masculine / feminine problem” with the grammatical gender, and does NOT require that this particle point to the first man, as opposed to a cherub. I’ve never actually seen this view in a commentary or journal article, but starting a casus pendens construction with the accusative marker is not uncommon. I think people don’t consider it because they are convinced the particle points to a man, to the ignoring of other conceptual parallels that point to a divine being between Gen 3, Isa 14, and Ezek 28.
MSH: Great point, although Im not familiar with those advanced hebrew grammar/syntax constructions, I can picture the explanation you provided.
This is almost like the issue with the Nachash of Genesis 3:1 where the usual noun “Nachash” could be an adjective in this particular case. But because commentators and even scholars may get bogged down by verse 14 and do not see other linking properties of the texts (Isaiah 14; 27 / Ezekiel 28) AND have not gotten into other external details that do have a relation with these texts (UFOs/Alien Abductions/Nephilim), they conclude otherwise.
MSH: Just a thought: I believe you explicitly mentioned in your book draft that the curse of the nachash in Genesis 3:14 could be linked to the curse in Ezekiel 28 (apart from Isaiah 14) as when the being is said to be cast to the ground (idiom for the earth as well as Sheol as you mention). However, if both Isaiah 14 and Ezekiel 28 refer to the downfall of Satan, this means that both apply PRIOR [Im not yelling, Im just emphasizing words since we cannot bold in here:)] to Genesis 3:1 since in Gen 3 the nachash is already corrupt. This entails the problem that Ezekiel 28 could not be connected with Genesis 3:14. Furthermore, you argue that Genesis 3:14 could be metaphorical but In Isaiah 65:25, the serpent being listed among the animals is said not to hurt anymore on the new earth and heaven God will create after this age. It states that the serpent’s food will be dust. This idiom of eating dust, if I am correct, expresses that it will crawl on the surface of the ground.
In other words, in Isaiah 14 and Ezekiel 28, he is cursed for his pride, but in Genesis 3, he is cursed for his lie and temptation towards Eve. Thus, he must have been cursed twice, and in this case, the latter seems to be a pun, a play on words, where literal serpents crawl on the ground.
Any clarifications?
@blop2008: first, how do we know an exact point of corruption? Why conclude that the nachash in Gen 3 was NOT proud? Second, the play on words works for all passages – a being is cast down to the erets/Sheol in all three. Third, how can the Isaiah passage be describing a yet future estate when the serpent crawls on the belly – don’t they NOW? Maybe I’m not following.
MSH: Alright, I realize I was not very clear in my questioning. Now I attempt once more to make it as clear as possible, but it all entails different questions, but my main question will be re-stated at the end below so that you do not feel overwhelmed by all the following details:
I wouldn’t know the exact point of corruption and I do not think scholars as you do either (tell me if you know). But I did not conclude, although this is what my typing may have portrayed, that the nachash apparently was already corrupt prior to Gen 3 solely on the details I have typed in the comment box. It may have seemed that way because I had not detailed some points that may have taken too long to comment on. SO, I somewhat assumed that you already agreed that the nachash was already corrupt prior to Gen 3 because right in that scene, he appears to have already fallen as described in Isaiah 14 and Ezekiel 28 SINCE the details of the curse in Gen 3:14 were the result of his specific temptation and lie to Eve and not the specific details about his pride and self elevation in Isaiah 14 and Ezekiel 28.
Anyways, The parallels between both of passages Isaiah 14 and Ezekiel 28 are clear. However, if Genesis 3:14 describe the curse as being a result from his lie/temptation towards Eve and rebellion against God’s words (Gen 3:14 says: “Because you have done this, curse are you…”) not only I, but most non-scholar readers if not all will not see the connections between Gen 3:14 and Is 14/Eze 28.
I do not want to reject the parallels between Gen 3/Is 14/Eze 28, I am just trying to get as deep as I can into this and see if all the apparent “holes” seen by non-scholars like us can be truly covered. As you know, this is one of the most troublous connections you will have to explain in more details in your book. You probably already have a detailed answer regarding this that will eventually appear on your http://www.myththatistrue.com website referenced in the footnotes.
I am not concluding that the shining one was not filled with pride in Gen 3, I am questioning the metaphorical curse in Gen 3:14 because of its apparent non-connection with Isaiah 14 /Ezekiel 28 that any casual reader, even Hebrew readers from Israel would not see. Which led me to reconsider the curse in Gen 3:14 as being difficult to reconcile with Is 14/ Eze 28. YES, indeed “ a being is cast down to the erets/Sheol in all three ”, BUT in Gen 3:14 the text at hand says that the result of the curse was specifically because he lied/tempted/murdered Eve (and Adam), and not due to the pride and self elevation seen in the other two passages.
As for Isaiah 65:25, this is really what I meant to say:
In Gen 3:1, the nachash is compared with the beasts of the field ( I know the Hebrew is not indicating that the nachash was part of the animals of the field ), why not compared to mankind that God had just created? So it must be a pun, a play on words or a double entendre as you mention in your book.
But then, in Gen 3:14 it must also be a pun by making reference to literal snakes that eat dust, since eating dust for a snake is supposedly a Semitic idiom to describe the crawling ability of a snake not that the snake literal eats dust. BUT in Isaiah 65:25 the serpents are described in the same manner, and so many evangelicals that believe that Satan impersonated a literal serpent in Genesis 3 believe that the literal serpents in Isaiah 65:25 that crawl remain under the curse of Gen 3:14 since it became a connotation of the evil Satan, as if the cursed was not removed. Thus, in your book you should include more details about the apparent details ( I am not the expert, you are ) that the curse in Gen 3:14 is not just metaphorical about the shining one but was also a play on words or idiomatic relating to literal serpents as well, which were always the way they are now and will always be in the future.
Here are my thoughts in an organized way, now it should be clear:
-Since Satan has an angelic-serpentine appearance by the Hebrew denotations/connotations of the Hebrew words NACHASH, SARAPH, SERAPHIM, and its Akkadian cognates, and that he was referenced in Gen 3:1 with the animals of the field, then it must have been idiomatic. But the Nachash himself: (1) was not an animal (2) did not become a literal looking serpent to speaking to Eve (3) Did not impersonate or possess a literal serpent to speak through its hiss/mouth.
-Serpent/Snakes have always looked as they look now and have always crawled as they crawl now (that was my point for bringing up Isaiah 65:25) and they are referred to as eating dust, which is an idiom to indicate precisely that – they crawl on the ground.
-Thus, the curse of Satan from God in Gen 3:14 did not affect the literal serpents/snakes (they did not have legs prior to the fall) of the field but was used idiomatically in reference to Satan now being cast down to a very low status, and eventually in the end will be cast into the lake of fire with his angels.
-However, as I already mentioned above and as I want to make this as clear as possible, the “hole” that I see now is the fact that Satan was cursed in Gen 3:14 for what he had done specifically in Gen 3 (liying/murdering/tempting) which has no real specific nor solid connections with Isaiah 14 and Ezekiel 28 since the latter two have to do with pride and self elevation apart. It is true that the idioms and motifs THEMSELVES in Gen 3:14 as crawling and being cursed ABOVE (not among) all beasts and living creatures of the field have connections with the same kinds of idioms/motifs seen in the other two passages, BUT again, in Gen 3:14 it doesn’t say it was because of his pride and self elevation.
-Furthermore, why keep comparing Satan with the beasts of the field, and why not make it clear that it was a divine being? These are you own words: “The text literally says, “ Now the serpent was craftier than any beasts of the field,” to which I say, no kidding—he was a divine being, so he ought to be smarter! ”. Indeed Mr. Heiser, no kidding why say he was craftier than the beasts of the field? Why wasn’t the text more clear? At least, more clear than the text at hand? CERTAINLY because in Gen 3:1, the author (God) and/or the pen-men (Maybe Moses?) decided to idiomatically refer to him as a serpent precisely because of his serpentine appearance.
My re-stated Questioning is this: It is true that the idioms and motifs THEMSELVES in Gen 3:14 as crawling and being cursed ABOVE (not among) all beasts and living creatures of the field have connections with the same kinds of idioms/motifs seen in Isaiah 14 and Ezekiel 28, BUT again, in Gen 3:14 it doesn’t say it was because of his pride and self elevation, but rather because of his lie/murder/temptation towards Eve (or mankind). So, this makes me question the parallels AND loosely makes me think that the Nachash was already corrupt prior to Gen 3 which then seems ( it only seems) not to correlate with Isaiah 14 and Ezekiel 28.
Was it clear now? 🙂
@blop2008: You wrote: “SO, I somewhat assumed that you already agreed that the nachash was already corrupt prior to Gen 3 because right in that scene, he appears to have already fallen as described in Isaiah 14 and Ezekiel 28 SINCE the details of the curse in Gen 3:14 were the result of his specific temptation and lie to Eve and not the specific details about his pride and self elevation in Isaiah 14 and Ezekiel 28.”
This depends on what you mean by “that scene” (which part?) – if the three passages are parallel, the punishment of the nachash occurs after Adam and Eve succumb. It is suggested that the motivation had something to do with hubris (“I will be like the most high”). I would suggest/guess that the high status given to humanity after their creation was what prompted this rebellion, and THAT would be the point where the nachash decided to get rid of the humans.
The three passages are not exact in every detail in terms of parallelism (just like the synoptic gospels are often not the same in the details of a story — but it is evident that the same story or event is in view in the synoptics). As a result, I think it isn’t advisable to try and squeeze every point in a harmony of all three. They are complementary. No one would judge the synoptics as not being synoptic because one or other lacks some details of the others. That is what you get with multiple accounts. It’s normal, and so we shouldn’t expect the presence of every element. If you picked up three headline stories of 9-11 they each would not have all the details of the others– but the event reported would be the same and they would be complementary. The hubris (it could be well argued) was the catalyst in all three; the “throwing down to the ground/erets/Sheol” is the judgment. The middle details are not present in all three, but all three agree in scene (Eden), intent of the Shining One, the presence of the Shining One, and his judgment.
It seems your biggest obstacle is wanting parallel passages to be “more parallel” – that wish just wouldn’t work in studying the synoptic gospels. We have what we have.
You wrote: “In Gen 3:1, the nachash is compared with the beasts of the field ( I know the Hebrew is not indicating that the nachash was part of the animals of the field ), why not compared to mankind that God had just created?”
I would ask, why assume the comparison was animal to animal? Of course a divine being is more intelligent than *anything else God had made* and any animal God had made. The statement is still quite true when you take my angle — it doesn’t change.
You wrote: “so many evangelicals that believe that Satan impersonated a literal serpent in Genesis 3 believe that the literal serpents in Isaiah 65:25 that crawl remain under the curse of Gen 3:14 since it became a connotation of the evil Satan, as if the cursed was not removed.”
Quite true- and those evangelicals are reading the “still under the curse” part into Isaiah’s snake.
Ultimately, ancient mythological literature (and I use “mythological” there in the academic sense) quite frequently has divine beings appear as animals — but no ancient person would think the animal WAS the deity. I think “nachash” has a double or triple entrendre here — but seeing the nachash as a divine being (not a mere member of the animal kingdom) is the ONLY way to reconcile the three passages.
MSH: Very well, I would have to agree with your response of the synoptic perspective especially due to the supposed variations of the mythological stories in the ANE background. This doesn’t mean the stories were copied and distorted by their receptors, but rather, the stories have a common parent from which spread in the ANE, just like the parallels and differences between the Epic of Gilgamesh and Genesis 1-2.
By the way, which electronic books from Logos would you suggest to study the Canaanite Texts and background texts that shed light on obscure passages in the scriptures?
Thanks.
@blop2008: I would suggest: (1) Context of Scripture – 3 volumes; (2) Pritchard’s Ancient Near Eastern Texts and the OT; (3) The “Writings from the Biblical World” series; (4) Wyatt’s English translation of the Ugaritic texts.
Any conclusion that these passages speak of the Devil, Satan or any personification of evil are only justified by taking extreme liberties at assumption, conjecture and speculation. Commonly only the passages actually supporting the belief are noted with little if any regard for context or cultural basis.
Firstly the entire chapters of both 26 and 27 are clearly directed toward the city of Tyrus.
Ezekiel 26:3 KJV – Therefore thus saith the Lord GOD; Behold, I [am] against thee, O Tyrus, and will cause many nations to come up against thee, as the sea causeth his waves to come up.
Ezekiel 27:3 KJV – And say unto Tyrus, O thou that art situate at the entry of the sea, [which art] a merchant of the people for many isles, Thus saith the Lord GOD; O Tyrus, thou hast said, I [am] of perfect beauty.
Subqequently Chapter 28 is clearly toward two predominant EARTHLY and HUMAN leaders.
Ezekiel 28:2 KJV – Son of man, say unto the prince of Tyrus:
Ezekiel 28:12 KJV – Son of man, take up a lamentation upon the king of Tyrus:
Let us first examine the word of the Lord to the Prince of Tyrus:
Ezekiel 28:4 KJV – With thy wisdom and with thine understanding thou hast gotten thee riches, and hast gotten gold and silver into thy treasures:
Ezekiel 28:5 KJV – By thy great wisdom [and] by thy traffick hast thou increased thy riches, and thine heart is lifted up because of thy riches:
Now examine the lamentation to the King of Tyrus
Ezekiel 28:16 KJV – By the multitude of thy merchandise they have filled the midst of thee with violence, and thou hast sinned: therefore I will cast thee as profane out of the mountain of God: and I will destroy thee, O covering cherub, from the midst of the stones of fire.
Ezekiel 28:18 KJV – Thou hast defiled thy sanctuaries by the multitude of thine iniquities, by the iniquity of thy traffick; therefore will I bring forth a fire from the midst of thee, it shall devour thee, and I will bring thee to ashes upon the earth in the sight of all them that behold thee.
One foundational argument is that this declaration is two-fold in its meaning.
The former is to be directed toward the human ruler or Prince who bears rule and sits upon the throne of Tyrus: while the latter “lamentation” is directed to the spiritual power that actually directs the human leaders actions.
However by historical record a “King” was the ruling prefect of a dominion. The role of “Prince” held by a Son of that prefect served in a subordinate position of authority and often as the executer of the Father’s decree. A common role of a ruling Prince was in the oversight of all military affairs. The term actually used in this passage translates to a “Captain” or “Leader.” The chapter addresses both the superior as well as the subordinate ruler.
The conclusion that any part of this chapter is remotely attributed to Satan is a matter of second guessing and simultaneously ignoring context, and well known cultural record.
This perspective is firmly predicated upon several passages of scripture that are defined as being exclusive only to the fallen entity called Satan. These passages are most often used in support of the any belief in a literal Satan along with Revelations.
To have a solid understanding two issues must be examined.
A. The Intention Of The Prince Of Tyrus.
B. The Nature Of The King Of Tyrus
A. The Intention Of The Prince Of Tyrus
Ezekiel 28:2 KJV – Son of man, say unto the prince of Tyrus, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Because thine heart [is] lifted up, and thou hast said, I [am] a God, I sit [in] the seat of God, in the midst of the seas; yet thou [art] a man, and not God, though thou set thine heart as the heart of God:
Ezekiel 28:6 KJV – Therefore thus saith the Lord GOD; Because thou hast set thine heart as the heart of God;
A cornerstone of this belief is the almost inhuman desire for power and godlike status demonstrated by the Prince of Tyrus. From the fundamentalist view it corresponds to the misconceptions of accepted doctrine ascribed to Satan.
Known historical record as well as scripture supports the fact that human kings often exalted themselves far beyond measure and were even deified by their subjects.
Egypt as an example held that the lineage of Pharaohs were in fact directly descended from God and were recognized as divinty incarnate in human form. This mindest and practice was almost universal exhibited in China through the mythology that Emperors were divine seed of dragon gods.
The terms translated as God in this passage are commonly used in relation to any deity as well as generically meaning any “Mighty one”.It subsequently could denote any magistrate or judge. This same term is ascribed to Nebuchadnezzer in the book of Daniel.
B. The Nature Of The King Of Tyrus
Ezekiel 28:12 KJV – Son of man, take up a lamentation upon the king of Tyrus, and say unto him, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Thou sealest up the sum, full of wisdom, and perfect in beauty.
Ezekiel 28:15 KJV – Thou [wast] perfect in thy ways from the day that thou wast created, till iniquity was found in thee.
Ezekiel 28:17 KJV – Thine heart was lifted up because of thy beauty, thou hast corrupted thy wisdom by reason of thy brightness: I will cast thee to the ground, I will lay thee before kings, that they may behold thee.
The common argument is no man could be recognized as being perfect and therefore this verse can only be attributed to Satan and his pressumed glorious nature before the fall from grace. Advocates of this belief also utilize the following New Testament verse to substantiate this claim:
2 Corinthians 11:14 KJV – And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light.
Minimal review within Gospel accounts reveal that Christ himself taught contrary:
John 8:44 KJV – Ye are of [your] father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.
Another foundational verse which this misconception is built upon is:
Ezekiel 28:13 KJV – Thou hast been in Eden the garden of God; every precious stone [was] thy covering, the sardius, topaz, and the diamond, the beryl, the onyx, and the jasper, the sapphire, the emerald, and the carbuncle, and gold: the workmanship of thy tabrets and of thy pipes was prepared in thee in the day that thou wast created.
Traditionalists argue conclusively that this verse can only be used in the context of the Genesis account. Who else but Satan could the reference address?
For a proper understanding we will examine the entire passage separating the text and scrutinizing line by line.
Ezekiel 28:13 KJV – Thou hast been in Eden the garden of God;
The term Eden simply means Pleasure, or delight and is rendered in other verses as as finery, luxury . The word translated Garden in this passage is “Enclosed Garden” the root word is to “Cover or Protect”. Interestingly it is also metaphorically used to speak of a “chaste woman” or “virgin” as demonstrated in the following verse:
Song of Songs 4:12 KJV – A garden inclosed [is] my sister, [my] spouse; a spring shut up, a fountain sealed.
The terms Eden and the phrase “Garden of God” are not exclusive to these passages. They are used elsewhere in scripture particularly in the context of earthly government. Metaphorically they relate to one being hedged in and speaks of being protected by divine providence.
Ezekiel 31:18 KJV – To whom art thou thus like in glory and in greatness among the trees of Eden? yet shalt thou be brought down with the trees of Eden unto the nether parts of the earth: thou shalt lie in the midst of the uncircumcised with [them that be] slain by the sword. This [is] Pharaoh and all his multitude, saith the Lord GOD.
Ezekiel 28:13 KJV- Every precious stone [was] thy covering, the sardius, topaz, and the diamond, the beryl, the onyx, and the jasper, the sapphire, the emerald, and the carbuncle, and gold:
Not unlike any ruler who had prospered in great wealth this man is garnished with precious and costly array. He is adorned with precious gemstones and gold jewelry.
Ezekiel 28:13 KJV-The workmanship of thy tabrets and of thy pipes was prepared in thee in the day that thou wast created.
The latter part of this verse has been used to justify several erroneous beliefs associated with Satan specific to his influence in music, praise, worship and artistic expression of every type.
While It should be noted that the terms “tabrets” and “pipes’ are commonly recognized as specifically meaning musical instruments these terms defined in the context of these passages are as follows:
1. Groove, socket, hole, cavity, settings.
2. A technical term relating to jeweller’s works defined as “ A bezel or socket for setting a gem”
Ezekiel 28:14 KJV – Thou [art] the anointed cherub that covereth; and I have set thee [so]: thou wast upon the holy mountain of God; thou hast walked up and down in the midst of the stones of fire.
Ezekiel 28:14 KJV – Thou [art] the anointed cherub that covereth;
The term “covering” or “Covereth” is rendered as to “Hedge…defend to fence”
Throughout scripture metaphorically many Kings or rulers are spoken of as great trees covering or shadowing the nations with their branches.
This is recorded in Daniel’s interpretation of the King of Babylon’s dreams:
Daniel 4:20 KJV – The tree that thou sawest, which grew, and was strong, whose height reached unto the heaven, and the sight thereof to all the earth;
Daniel 4:21 KJV – Whose leaves [were] fair, and the fruit thereof much, and in it [was] meat for all; under which the beasts of the field dwelt, and upon whose branches the fowls of the heaven had their habitation:
Daniel 4:22 KJV – It [is] thou, O king, that art grown and become strong: for thy greatness is grown, and reacheth unto heaven, and thy dominion to the end of the earth.
Also regarding Pharaoh and the Egyptian nations:
Ezekiel 31:2 KJV – Son of man, speak unto Pharaoh king of Egypt, and to his multitude; Whom art thou like in thy greatness?
Ezekiel 31:3 KJV – Behold, the Assyrian [was] a cedar in Lebanon with fair branches, and with a shadowing shroud, and of an high stature; and his top was among the thick boughs.
Ezekiel 31:6 KJV – All the fowls of heaven made their nests in his boughs, and under his branches did all the beasts of the field bring forth their young, and under his shadow dwelt all great nations.
Ezekiel 31:8 KJV – The cedars in the garden of God could not hide him: the fir trees were not like his boughs, and the chesnut trees were not like his branches; nor any tree in the garden of God was like unto him in his beauty.
Ezekiel 31:9 KJV – I have made him fair by the multitude of his branches: so that all the trees of Eden, that [were] in the garden of God, envied him.
Ezekiel 31:18 KJV – To whom art thou thus like in glory and in greatness among the trees of Eden? yet shalt thou be brought down with the trees of Eden unto the nether parts of the earth: thou shalt lie in the midst of the uncircumcised with [them that be] slain by the sword. This [is] Pharaoh and all his multitude, saith the Lord GOD.
Ezekiel 28:14 KJV – Thou wast upon the holy mountain of God;
The point is to define what exactly is the Holy Mountain. Is it indeed Heaven? With a cursory analysis of scripture we can easily define the phraseology used in these passages
Isaiah 66:20 And they shall bring all your brethren [for] an offering unto the LORD out of all nations upon horses, and in chariots, and in litters, and upon mules, and upon swift beasts, to my HOLY MOUNTAIN JERUSALEM, saith the LORD.
Ezekiel 20:40 For in MINE HOLY MOUNTAIN in the mountain of the height of Israel,(Jerusalem) saith the Lord GOD,
Dan 9:16 O Lord, according to all thy righteousness, I beseech thee, let thine anger and thy fury be turned away from thy city JERUSALEM THY HOLY MOUNTAIN.
Joel 2:1 Blow ye the trumpet in Zion, and sound an alarm in MY HOLY MOUNTAIN.
Joel 3:17 So shall ye know that I [am] the LORD your God dwelling in ZION MY HOLY MOUNTAIN: then shall Jerusalem be holy,
Every verse noted always attributes the term HOLY MOUNTAIN specifically to Jerusalem or properly to Zion the heart of Isreal and never indicates Heaven or the spiritual realms.
Ezekiel 28:14 KJV – Thou walked up and down in the midst of the stones of fire.
In the context of the entire passage this phrase would also strengthen the emphasis on the extreme wealth and riches which have come into the King’s hand. Interestingly the term “Stones Of Fire” has been often used by ancient cultures to describe the properties of polished gemstones.
THE JUDGEMENT
As directed to the Prince of Tyrus:
“yet thou [art] a man”
Not a spiritual being.
“thou shalt die the deaths of [them that are] slain in the midst of the seas.”
A physical death by drowning.
Thou shalt die the deaths of the uncircumcised by the hand of strangers: for I have spoken [it], saith the Lord GOD.
Again a physical death by the hand of men?? No mention of eternal judgment of torments???
As directed to the King of Tyrus
Ezekiel 28:18 therefore will I bring forth a fire from the midst of thee, it shall devour thee, and I will bring thee to ashes upon the earth in the sight of all them that behold thee.
The term ashes translates directly to a period of mourning observed in repentence “sackclothe and ASHES” and this word is used repeatably in the old testament.
1. Consequently the same exhaustive process applied to Isaiah: quickly deconstructs any fundamentalist argument on that basis.
Isa 14:4 That thou shalt take up this proverb against the king of Babylon, and say, How hath the oppressor ceased! the golden city ceased!
Cheers DR. RW Stoufus
To note: The term
Cherub comes from an obscure root word.
In ancient Jewish theology the image of the Cherubim were always equated with wisdom and divine knowledge.
However its common scriptural usage was regarding specifically the ornate craftmanship in the tabernacle of Moses.
Exd 25:19 And make one cherub on the one end, and the other cherub on the other end: [even] of the mercy seat shall ye make the cherubims on the two ends thereof.
The best known usage is in Genesis
Gen 3:24 So he drove out the man; and he placed at the east of the garden of Eden Cherubims, and a flaming sword which turned every way, to keep the way of the tree of life.
In full analysis of the entire context of Ezekiel Chapter 28 it is not possible to build an argument to address this toward anything but a human ruler.
DR. RW Stoufus
@DR. RW Sinclair Stoufus: apparently you haven’t read much material to the contrary. YOu seem to think that because the cycles are against the prince of Tyre and Babylon that they don’t refer to another non-human entity. It is a story of a non-human entity that is being used to taunt these human kings (i.e., the taunt works because it is an older myth-genre piece applied to these kings). The two are not mutually exclusive. And that’s just for starters. If you want bibliography, let me know. I’m not going to repeat the contrary information on a blog comment.
@DR. RW Sinclair Stoufus: no kidding. Everyone knows the taunts are directed at human rulers. But you miss the point (see my comment to your previous post).
I can see that DR. RW Sinclair Stoufus has not done a thorough research. How unfortunate, because he apparently refers to ANE perspectives (roles of kings/princes) but misapplies them to Ezekiel 28 in the wrong passages. He wants to contextualize Isaiah/Ezekiel but does the opposite in some areas. He assumes that we agree with the “Traditional view” that Satan is depicted as literally have fallen from Heaven unto the earth in Ezekiel 28, rather than falling from his position on an earthly mountain of God where there was a connection with the divine council (cf with Dr. Robert D. Luginbill , “The Satanic Rebellion: Background to the Tribulation”, Parts 1,2, & 3, http://www.ichthys.com/Satanic%20Rebellion%20Home%20Page.htm, accessed June 2009). He also assumes that the taunt starts prior to verses 11-12 in Ezekiel 28 and thus undeliberately falsifies the traditional view (I’ve never read or heard that the angelic Satan appears prior to those verses!)
Wow, I am thoroughly exhausted after trying to read this comment section.
I had no idea people could write this much on a blog. I really need to start leaving longer comments. 😉
Kevin, I so totally agree with you. I thrilled just to be able to read through all this stuff-understand at least some of it- much less write anything that resembles it. LOL
But I did have a simple thought (as I come at this with little background), and that is on the issue of the serpent/nachash and its being craftier than any other beast of the field. Would it not be possible that another reason Eve was so taken with the nachash was that it simply was “craftier”(?) meaning: more intelligent and more interesting? Up to that point, we only know that the Yahweh “walked with them in the cool of the day”. This seems to simply that it was done on his terms alone. Now, since Eve came from Adam’s side…is it not possible that those two knew one another extremely well? To me, this, again, seems to suggest that Eve was possibly taken with the “newness/diffence/diversity” of the nachash. Almost as though she was getting bored with what she did have around her. Sometimes we make things too difficult.
As my granddaughter would have said…”Grandma, Eve was just wanting another nice friend to play with”! Oops.
This might well be a reminded that we need to hold tightly to that which is well-known and familiar (such as Torah), rather than wanting to venture forth into unknown territory as did Eve. I don’t know? But it was just a thought. And it does go to show that “all that glitters(as did the Shining One)might not be gold”, despite its appearance to the contrary!
it seems you think cherubims are stupid,the reason humanity overflows angels is because they are not the complete package.very clever one yes,very loving another yes,very angry another yes.humans are a complete package angels can,t top.
so they use others to put humans down or restrict there development,which you might be helping with greed ,ignorance or believing lies.
I can’t even begin to decipher the point of this response.
MSH: Your attempt a lucid response has failed .
Rubbish my good man: utter rubbish!
Cheers
DR. RW Sinclair Stoufus
although I don’t know what this is about (maybe it’s related to an old thread) you sound like an doofus, Dr. Stoufus. Now, if you can refrain from name calling, can you remind me what this is about?
BLOP2008: I wonder should it be possible for both yourself and your unlearned associate “MSH” to receive a refund of sorts for the $39.95 U.S you obviously pilfered on Internet Bible study courses?
DR. RW Sinclair Stoufus
no idea what this is even about – ?
Wow very interesting debate o condemnations by Ezechiel. Michael wrote : YOu seem to think that because the cycles are against the prince of Tyre and Babylon that they don’t refer to another non-human entity.
I wonder what Ezekiel would write about our current american empire? Would the religious condemnation rather be politically motivated to some extent? it is a entire new debate.
Michael, to whom the Ezekiel writings attributed to? is it attributed to Moses?
no, it’s attributed to Ezekiel, but a final form of it would have been edited by other hands.
Here a a suggested site for the Tomb of Ezekiel,,, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ezekiel%27s_Tomb.
in he Wiki, it i suggested that Dhul-Kift would be ezekiel.. err I am skeptical at best as both these men appears different. Could 2 people share the same tomb?
Video of the tomb- noticeable is hebrew writings..
http://higher-criticism.com/2010/01/muslims-destroying-prophet-ezekiels-tomb.html
http://www.cross-currents.com/archives/2010/10/21/yechezkels-kever/
Ps.82:5 to 8 First MAN was created above in spirit form. Genesis 6:3 Man entered the Vessel Flesh of male or female and Man entered the Vessel with a broken off spirit that does not always strive with G-D’S Spirit.
In the Vessel of all Mankind G-D redeems His seeds that came after MAN’S FALL. Every Day that comes we are all redeemed and all given the SAME spiritual DNA from the House of G-D Jeremiah 31:27 for Days Come in all our life times. Jeremaih 32:27.
Proverbs 20:27 The Spirit of Man is the CANDLE of THE LORD, searching all the INWARD PARTS of the BELLY.
We are to grow back with a Right Spirit-With-in-Us. To seek out G-D to heal what He broke off.
Psalm 51:8 Make me to HEAR joy and gladness; that the bones which Thou has broken may rejoice.
Psalm 51:11 Cast me not away from Thy Presence; and take not Thy Holy Spirit from me.
We must draw G-D in holy union with us, that we may enter in His Spirit.
To enter in THE ETERNAL FLAME OF HEAVEN it bruns NIGHT & DAY on the reverse side. Spiritual speaking THIS DAY is forever for TIME can not contain G-D nor does it exist above the earth.
THIS DAY is were we enter in HOLY UNION with G-D and His Spirit. Deut.29:13-14 verse 15 note THIS DAY G-D embraced us in His heart & mind. THIS DAY is were we NOW make our choices to chose good and life or evil and death. Deut.30:15-16 -19-20 THIS DAY our G-D set it in PLACE for our return to the FORMER THING first Done above. Ecc.1:9. Our APPOINTED DAY the LORD made for our Re-turn to the FORMER THING first DONE shall be DONE: but under the shadow of the Almighty in the Presence of The Most High. Psalm 91:1.
This happens when we HEAR the instructions of G-D Proverbs 1:7-8 and enter in His Spirit, His Womb, His BELLY to grow it is HIS LAW, the Declare Decree: Psalm 2:7 and Psalm 17:15.
BUT those we fell with , those Princes Psalm 82:5 to 8 verse 7 Princes. They remained spirits in the earth . Psalm 75:12 and Psalm 2:1 to 7 War on G-D and His anointed in the earth. They hid in all forms of things Isaiah 28:15. Religions were made and rituals, customs, and holy days and feast days in these Relgions Isaiah 1:12-13-14 G-D did not ask this from your hand and HATES IT.
G-D told the SONS OF G-D not to write many books or study them. Ecc.12:12 they did not listen. And they added and added to the WHOLE DUTY of mankiind in them Ecc.12:13 and Isaiah 30:1.
They never let the people see that to ReTurn was to enter in THE ETERNAL FLAME OF HEAVEN SPIRITUAL ENTER IN. To light their desires to HIS. Pslam 51:6 BEHOLD, Thou desirest truth in the INWARD PARTS: ( that remember searches the BELLY ) and in the Hidde Part Thou shalt MAKE me Know wisdom. Jeremiah 31:33 But this shall be the covenant that I will MAKE with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD, I will put MY LAW in their INWARD PARTS; and write it in their hearts; and will be their G-D, and they shall be MY people.
We are to stretch froth our spiritual cords that UNITE us with G-D of Heaven & Earth in Holy Uniion.
King Solomon seek out the One Whom His soul does love and drew G-D near . Song of Solomon 3:1 to 4. The Chamber opens and we are conceived again in spirit in the vessel flesh of male or female A NEW CREATION in the earth A WOMAN Jeremiah 31:22.
We are the STONES of 1 Kings 6:7 that was gathered and made ready strong for HIMSELF Ps.80:15 and Psalm 118:22-23 we entered THIS DAY. Ps.118:24.
We are the STONES OF FIRE in the earth…Stones of healing, we entered HIS WOMB Jer.1:5 to 10 and stand up now in the midst of many people and nations. We are to tear down and build up . We are the battle axe and weapons of war in His hand. Jeremiah 51:20 the seeds of PROMISE DAN & JUDAH that will pull down DEATH the horse and his rider Prince of lies and deceits. Jeremaih 51:21
Iam from above and below. Once a ray of light around His Thrown .
Job 33:4 The spirit of G-D hath made me, ( MAN above a god a spirit form that entered a vessel of FLESH Ps.82: 5 to 8 read verse 6 MAN in a broken spirit, verse 8 first MAN in a vessel of flesh of male or female now in a new creation in the earth below a new thing done: for it is written: Ecc.1:9 ‘shall be done:. Yes Done a New Creation a NEW THING in the Presence of The Most High under the shadow of the Almighty. Ps.91:1 and Jeremiah 31:22 a WOMAN spiritual in the vessel flesh of male or female. The LAST shall be the FIRST and the FIRST the LAST.
Now: Look, Listen SEE and HEAR MAN above is WOMAN below…
Job 33:4 The SPIRIT OF G-D hath made me ( MAN above ), and the BREATH of the Almighty hath given me life. ( A WOMAN below is healed from what spiritualy was broken off by G-D )
Psalm 51:8 MAKE me to hear joy and gladness; that the bones which Thou hast BROKEN may rejoice.
Psalm 18:15 Then the channels of waters were SEEN ( Isaiah35:8 ), and the Foundations of The World were Descovered at Thy rebuke, O LORD, at the BLAST OF THE BREATH OF THY NOSTRILS.
Psalm 18:16 HE sent from ABOVE, HE took me, HE drew me OUT of many waters.
Isaiah 35:8 And the HIGHWAY shall BE THERE, and a WAY, and it shall be called THE WAY OF HOLINESS; the unclean shall not pass over it; WAYFARING MEN, though fools, shall not err thereIN.
The world as you see it, is nothing, the KINGDOM OF G-D as we see it has been moved out from your TIME in space. There is no TIME in Eternity is just does not exist for us.
I am the from what was PLANTED by Jeremiah for G-D Himself made strong to grow back in HIS RIGHT HAND. First created above MAN now created below WOMAN made in His fullness a SON OF G-D . Summoned from Dan & Judah I Stand Up His Tent in the earth. Jeremiah 4:5 For a voice declareth form DAN, and PUBLISHETH affliction form mount Ephraim. 16 Make ye mention to the nations; BEHOLD, publish against Jerusalem, that WATCHERS COME from a FAR COUNTRY, and give out their voice against the cities of JUDAH.
REad the full chapter: WATCHERS COME from a FAR COUNTRY.
YOu are not alone in the CREATION of G-D …there are others many…Look, Listen to some that may or may not come and Rule over you….all about your choices you are making in your life. Jer.33:25-26 note the end words in verse 26 and Micah 5:15.
Look, Listen you are NOT alone…never was or never will be alone..Jeremaih 5:15-17 and Jeremiah 6:22-23 and Jeremiah 50:41-42 and LOOK, LISTEN on this earth there are others… all you 1# INHABITANTS OF THE WORLD 2# and DWELLERS ON THE EARTH. read Isaiah 18:3 then read the rest of chapter 18.
G-D addresses THE WHOLE EARTH in Isaiah 18: for a REASON to OPEN your EYES and EARS , look and listen….WAKE UP ! I have not made you alone….Gen.4:14 the house of Cain is above you off the face of this earth, only to fly over and look down never to settle down ever again in the earth.
When learned men or woman come upon TRUTH that others speak of they use the MSH to explain away they DO not KNOW what is being said. humm
So Listen UP ! you who have not grown ears to hear and eyes to see.
Isaiah 10:16 Therefore shall the LORD, the LORD OF HOST, send among HIS fat ones leanness: ( you my little worms in your Graves spiritual dead…have eaten up your own fat and NOT from the TABLE OF THE LORD as Jacob your for father did Gen.28:20-21 nor did you come into the house of His Father in Peace.)….and under HIS glory HE shall kindle a burning like the burning of a fire.
We are the STONES OF FIRE from above that His Spirit MADE ready to Build His Temple above 1 Kings 6:7 and below Psalm 118:22-23.
Isaiah 10:17 And the LIGHT OF ( G-D) ISRAEL shall be for a FIRE, and His Holy One for a FLAME: and it shall burn and devour HIS thorns and his briers in one day.
Proverbs 20:27 The SPIRIT of MAN is the CANDLE of the LORD, searching all the INWARD PARTS of the BELLY.
We have lighten our hearts & minds DESIRES from THE ETERNAL FLAME OF HEAVEN that burns in the Heart & Minds Desire of G-D. Psalm 51:6 we search the INWARD PARTS of the BELLY and are BEGOTTEN sons of G-D. Together we come to let HIS SPIRIT weave us TOGETHER one people Jeremiah 31:33. We are the CURTAINS that were riped apart in HIS HOUSE. Read for understanding what must come…into the house of G-D. Jeremiah 10:20. See who cuts and rips Ps.2:1 to 7. verse 7 is the CORDS they cut down. It is G-D’S LAW when you HEAR and OBEY. Jer.11:7-8 and Proverbs 1:7-8.
Isaiah 6:9 And He said, GO, and tell this people, HEAR YE indeed, but understand NOT: and SEE YE indeed but preceive NOT.
Isaiah 6:9 Make the heart of this people FAT, and make their ears HEAVY, and SHUT there ears, least they see with their eyers; and hear with there ears, and understand with their heart, and ovnvert a, and be healed.
You study the many books of mankind and princes…in the earth The angel of darkenss, his spiritual wickedness hid in them all. Over and Over you were told to LOOK, and LISTEN but you are sooooooo puffed up in your own knowledge, there is NO breath of the Almighty in you.
Jeremiah 10:14 EVERY man is brutish in his KNOWLEDGE: EVERY founder ( of all relgions every one) is CONFOUNDED by the graven image: for his molten image is falsehood, and there is no breath in them. 15 They are all vanity , and work of errors: in the time of their visitation, they shall PERISH. ( over it is written to look, listen you stiff necked people walking in dung ! your spiritual DEAD walking with these gods…DEAD….little worm of Jacob . Come Up out of your Graves and take hold of the LIVING G-D THE G-D OF HOST, you are spilling your seeds out, enter in HIS WOMB in THIS DAY forever with Him Jeremiah 10:20. Be given the BREATH of the ALMIGHTY. CHOSE LIFE not death. read Micah 4:5 rethink.
Isaiah 34:16 seek out the BOOK OF THE LORD for His Spirit gathers you into HIS WOMB.
ECCLESIASTES 12:12 And further, by these, MY SON, be ADMONISHED: of making many books there is no end; and much study is a weariness of the flesh.
ECCLESIASTES 12:13 Let us hear the conclusion of the WHOLE MATER: FEAR G-D, and KEEP HIS COMMANDMENTS: for this is the WHOLE DUTY OF MANKIND.
But mankind added and added in their many books G-D told them NOT TO MAKE or STUDY…and added feast days , holy days, sabbaths days, new moon, and rituals, customs and so on and so on it just does not end to the WICKEDNESS of your INAGINATIONS . read Jeremiah 11:7-8 THIS DAY come in and grow ears to hear and eyes to see, heal that broken spirit-with-in-you. Isaiah 1:12-13-14 and Isaiah 1:5-6-7 Re-think.
The “stones of fire” are your ten planets found in the Garden of God (outter space) and not some hills up in Heaven, the mountain of God (Ezekiel 28:13)…. The Dragon Cherub (Lucifer) used to walk up and down these planets (Ezekiel 28:13-14) and govern the pre-Adam physical Man in his various physical enterprises in the cities, not caves, on the planets (Ezekiel 28:16, 18)….When Lucifer sinned, God had to make the planets “without form and void” and wipe out the first physical man (Jeremiah 4:23-26). He turned off the light (which was not our sun) and froze the water covering the earth, starting the ice age (Jeremiah 4:23 and Genesis 1:2).
this isn’t the way the recipients of the material saw things. Sorry. Kind of entertaining though.
Michael,
Hello!
Check out amazon.com to purchase 2 books by KAT KERR
REVEALING HEAVEN VOL I and REVEALING HEAVEN VOL II.
In Vol II go to Chapter 7, page 81 for the revelation of the “stones of fire”.
May you encounter Yahweh while reading this book in such a way that you are NEVER … EVER… the same again.
Great grace be unto you from Yahweh, GREAT grace and DEEP love from His heart to yours.
Sincerely
Mrs Webb
Trust in the Lord with ALL your heart and LEAN NOT on your OWN understanding,
in all your ways acknowledge HIM and He shall direct your paths. Prov 3:5-6
In reply to Mountain Saint Oct 6, 2012:
I also urge you to get hold of a copy of Kat Kerr’s book “Revealing Heaven Vol II”.
Read pages 50-55 to get an accurate and exciting understanding of creation, the ice age, satan etc. The TRUTH is far more amazing and makes more sense than what we try and explain away with our own understanding. I pray you hunger and thirst after righteousness.
Be blessed by Yeshua, the Way, the Truth and the Life.
Matthew 5:6 Blessed are those who hunger and thirst for righteousness, for they shall be filled.
Sincerely
Mrs Webb
The guardian cherub in Ezekiel 28:14 was Lucifer before he was kicked out of Heaven and became Satan. Lucifer was guardian of the stones that were in front of God`s throne and they are listed in Ezekiel 28:13; ruby, topaz, emerald, chrysolite, onyx, jasper, sapphire, turquoise and beryl. God`s feet sat on something like a pavement made of sapphire, clear as the sky itself (Exodus 24:10) and the glory of God looked like a consuming fire (Exodus 24:17).
Hi Dr Heiser.
Really find interesting to witness parallels in other Ancient literature concerning the worldview of those days.
We clearly lost a complete section of Bible understanding by the rejection of the perspectives the Ancient had when they wrote of read. Find it quite sad that the Churches or Assemblies have kept these important pieces of information from their members… what a lost of ground knowledge.
On a side note, by reading the quote above from Enoch 1, I was attracted to the phrase “to demons as to gods”. So, clearly in those days “demons” and “gods” were viewed as different entities. Since I don’t know the original language of Enoch 1, could I assume that Enoch 1 is speaking about “elohim” and the Babylonian “shedim” here, or is it something even more specific?
Take care. Regards from the Philippines